The One Piece Takeaway

EdZ
Many of the games greats have held the "one piece takeaway" in very high regard - Byron Nelson and Jack Nicklaus for example.

Does this, by definition, make them hitters? No startup swivel.

Or does "one piece" really relate to the relationship of the hands and the chest - the shoulder line. Hogan maintained this relationship very well, with about as much startup swivel as you could have!

The triangle.

Percy Boomer 'spoke' of this relationship, the hands and chest, as the key difference between good players, and great players.

Ballard's view was an extension of Boomer's - 'connection' as he calls it.

I would suggest this relationship, of the hands to the chest through impact - is the fundamental root of Rhythm.

Does the right forearm pickup destroy the triangle? Or does this only matter when using accumulator #4, such that 3 barrel folks don't need to worry about it so much?

Whenever my swing gets off, I often come back to the one piece takeaway drill - hold a club about halfway down the shaft, with the grip end touching your belly - feeling the takeaway with the shoulders - hip high to hip high. Many will quickly see they need to work on their flexibility, the main reason many dismiss this move IMO.

Pivot controled hands, some may say. Not if you are monitoring your hands per 5-0!

How does this fit in with Homer's views on the importance of the triangle?
Yoda
This is a great post, Ed. Thanks!

Now, given the several gambits Ed has put before us, in what direction will this 'lovely' go? We will see. The field is wide open!
6bmike
I remember a story about Homer calling that Ballard triangle as "that silly thing."

Yes- no?
Yoda
Originally Posted by EdZ
Many of the games greats have held the "one piece takeaway" in very high regard - Byron Nelson and Jack Nicklaus for example.
Okay, let's start with this:

Byron Nelson -- the original Mr. One Piece -- started his Stroke from the Swinger's Classic Adjusted Address Position. In other words, his Left Wrist was Bent and his Right Wrist was Flat. As he moved away from the Ball, both Wrists retained their respective alignments well into the Backstroke. That is the 'One Piece.' Add a little flexibility of 'lag and drag' and, on video, Byron Nelson clearly evidences the 'Lagging Clubhead Takeaway' of Homer Kelley's as yet unpublished seventh edition.

The One-Piece Takeaway of Jack Nicklaus is quite different. His 'static' Forward Press moves his Hands into their Impact Fix alignments -- Flat Left and Bent Right -- and his In Line Left Arm and Club appear frozen in stone as the Club moves away from the Ball. I have personally witnessed many times the underside of his Left Wrist firm, the Wrist harden and the blood vessels bulge just prior to Start Up.

And yet, in his tape Golf My Way, he describes his own Start Up sensations of "Soft Forearms" and the move as "with all your effort, just relax" and "sort of drag the club away from the ball." In other words, a totally different look -- but very 'One Piece' -- and yet still a "Lagging Clubhead Takeaway" Feel.

And what of the Hitter's Non-Lagging Clubhead Takeaway with its Carry Back look and Feel? Surely this is One Piece also.

Classic Address Position.

Impact Address Position.

Lagging Clubhead Takeaways (Swinging / Swing Back).

Non-Lagging Clubhead Takeaways (Hitting / Carry Back).

All One Piece Takeaways.

Is there any real substance to this warhorse of golf terms?

Or does it rank right up there with "strong left side" in its abiltiy to imply much and deliver little.

Comments...

Please!
12 piece bucket
I don't know if there is any to this, but Fat Jack and Mr. Nelson both advocates of "one piece" employed what looks like to me a Punch Basic Swinging Stroke. Is this just coincidence?

Also, who the heck would want to take away "ONE piece?" I take away at least FOUR pieces. Somehow I bet Mr. Nicklaus took away 5 or 6 pieces. And when I'm taking up my pieces I ALWAYS do it by bending the right elbow . . . sometimes both elbows.
YodasLuke
Originally Posted by 12 piece bucket I don't know if there is any to this, but Fat Jack and Mr. Nelson both advocates of "one piece" employed what looks like to me a Punch Basic Swinging Stroke. Is this just coincidence?

Also, who the heck would want to take away "ONE piece?" I take away at least FOUR pieces. Somehow I bet Mr. Nicklaus took away 5 or 6 pieces. And when I'm taking up my pieces I ALWAYS do it by bending the right elbow . . . sometimes both elbows.
Before Yoda got a hold of you, I saw you swing. And, I thought you had a 12 piece takeaway. (Is there a new handle in the future?)
12 piece bucket
Originally Posted by YodasLuke Before Yoda got a hold of you, I saw you swing. And, I thought you had a 12 piece takeaway. (Is there a new handle in the future?)
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm . . . .


Originally Posted by The Infamous Festus Haggen of GUNSMOKE Ain't you startin' to itch before you git bit?
tongzilla
Originally Posted by Yoda
Byron Nelson -- the original Mr. One Piece -- started his Stroke from the Swinger's Classic Adjusted Address Position. In other words, his Left Wrist was Bent and his Right Wrist was Flat. As he moved away from the Ball, both Wrists retained their respective alignments well into the Backstroke. That is the 'One Piece.' Add a little flexibility of 'lag and drag' and, on video, Byron Nelson clearly evidences the 'Lagging Clubhead Takeaway' of Homer Kelley's as yet unpublished seventh edition.
Wasn't Byron a Hitter? Or am I thinking of someone else...
sky72
IMHO, to properly answer this question, the phrase "one piece take-away" must be defined precisely. (1) Clearly, because of the complex nature of the joints etc of the human body, a "one piece take-away" is not possible! (2) The disparity in what the great swingers of golf have written about their take-away/swing is imbedded in the "feel vs reality" struggle. (3) After all is said and done, the one piece take-away is perhaps a blending of the arms/club motion & the body rotation during the initial part of the swing. (4) This blending can be accomplished & therefore felt many ways! [see (2) above] (5) I have worked with Ballard & he constantly states that the folding of the right arm in the take-away sets the left wrist/club. His folding of the right arm may just be later than in other methods, which is OK. (6) Ballard also imparts this feel statement, "right forearm & left knee takeaway". Perhaps the great teachers of the golf swing are not as far apart as one may think! (7) Perhaps it is stated best by saying the club should not be swung independent of body motion!! One follows the other, which is FELT differently by the great swingers! sky72
Yoda
Originally Posted by tongzilla
Wasn't Byron a Hitter? Or am I thinking of someone else...
Byron Nelson was definitely a Swinger. His Stroke is wonderfully captured in the video Byron Nelson's Timeless Golf Lessons produced by HPG Video. It features Byron in his prime with both irons and woods. This isn't a collection of grainy tournament clips; instead, it is footage recorded especially for a golf instruction series that played in movie theaters at the time. The slow motion sequences are wonderful studies, and Byron himself does voice-over analysis. The video deserves a place in every golfer's collection.
tongzilla
Originally Posted by Yoda Byron Nelson was definitely a Swinger. His Stroke is wonderfully captured in the video Byron Nelson's Timeless Golf Lessons produced by HPG Video. It features Byron in his prime with both irons and woods. This isn't a collection of grainy tournament clips; instead, it is footage recorded especially for a golf instruction series that played in movie theaters at the time. The slow motion sequences are wonderful studies, and Byron himself does voice-over analysis. The video deserves a place in every golfer's collection.
Thanks for the reference. I will definately try to get a copy of that video.
EdZ
Leo - you may also enjoy his book, which has a collection of very nice photos - nearly every other page is a full size photo.
12 piece bucket
Originally Posted by Yoda Okay, let's start with this:

Byron Nelson -- the original Mr. One Piece -- started his Stroke from the Swinger's Classic Adjusted Address Position. In other words, his Left Wrist was Bent and his Right Wrist was Flat. As he moved away from the Ball, both Wrists retained their respective alignments well into the Backstroke. That is the 'One Piece.' Add a little flexibility of 'lag and drag' and, on video, Byron Nelson clearly evidences the 'Lagging Clubhead Takeaway' of Homer Kelley's as yet unpublished seventh edition.
As always . . . I took your advice and purchased Byron Nelson's Winning Golf off of e-bay. I agree with the above analysis. I'm not sure that Mr. Nelson's takeaway was a SHOULDER TURN TAKEAWAY based on a review of the pictures. It looks like the Lagging Right Forearm Takeaway to Bucket.

I'll scan and post.
Yoda
Originally Posted by 12 piece bucket
As always . . . I took your advice and purchased Byron Nelson's Winning Golf off of e-bay. I agree with the above analysis. I'm not sure that Mr. Nelson's takeaway was a SHOULDER TURN TAKEAWAY based on a review of the pictures. It looks like the Lagging Right Forearm Takeaway to Bucket.

I'll scan and post.
Great, Colonel. Our members need to see this...one of golf's all-time great Takeaways. Thanks!
curtisj76
Dug this out of the grave. Still a way to post 12?