Turned Shoulder Plane, Elbow Plane, etc

Is the Turned Shoulder plane basically more upright (J. Nicklaus) vs. the Elbow plane being flatter (aka Hogan).

Please explain as I really dont quite understand this.

Originally Posted by 300Drive Is the Turned Shoulder plane basically more upright (J. Nicklaus) vs. the Elbow plane being flatter (aka Hogan).

Please explain as I really dont quite understand this.

yes, the elbow plane is 'flatter' than the turned shoulder plane, which is flatter than the squared shoulder plane, which is flatter than the "turning" shoulder plane (in 'feel' if not in reality)

The more upright, the less of a 'cone' and the straighter the delivery path of the hands 'can' be

10-6-D......

"Its most obvious feature is the verticle line of muscular effort - an inclined plane with a verticle force. It is extremely effective and dynamically correct. Study 2-L#2, 2-N-1 and 2P."

Nicklaus.....

My swing has traditioanlly been long (too long), and upright, and ugly...... So, with the help of Lynn last year, I have been applying extensor action with my right hand and slowly change the shape of my swing. More swinger throughout action via the pivot

So, on what plane would you characterise hogan, immelman, player, c. campbell. Whatever that is, its what I am trying to immulate. It will help me focus on the right discussions.
Thanks.

Turned Shoulder Plane - per 12-1 or 12-2

This provides the best combination of power and accuracy - and ability to work the ball.

More upright planes can be useful, but tend towards requiring a fade (Hoch, Litzkie)

In both pics, the yellow line is the Turned Shoulder Plane (from ball through Top-of-stroke right shoulder position). Pink line = Elbow Plane (from ball through Address right elbow position). Blue line is clubshaft angle at Address.

Toms is a little underplane at Impact BTW.

Originally Posted by birdie_man In both pics, the yellow line is the Turned Shoulder Plane (from ball through Top-of-stroke right shoulder position). Pink line = Elbow Plane (from ball through Address right elbow position). Blue line is clubshaft angle at Address.

Ah!, thanks Bird Man (are you also a Coltrane fan). Anyway, I like the plane VJ is comming down on much better than that of Toms (for me).

Its strikes me that Hogan, Player, etc were on an even flatter plane than the pictures shown here (not by a lot, but, still flatter). Would theres not be called elbow plane. If not, is anyone on the elbow plane?

Never heard of Coltrane....

Is it this guy?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Coltrane

I like mostly rock.....Jimi, Zep, Floyd, Dylan, Neil Young, Petty, Ozzy, Metallica, RageAgainstTheMachine, Cash, Skynyrd, etc....any rock that's good.

Originally Posted by birdie_man Never heard of Coltrane....

Is it this guy?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Coltrane

I like mostly rock.....Jimi, Zep, Floyd, Dylan, Neil Young, Petty, Ozzy, Metallica, RageAgainstTheMachine, Cash, Skynyrd, etc....any rock that's good.

Coltrane.... one of my "favorite things"

A true jazz original who took "Giant Steps" forward.

Originally Posted by EdZ Coltrane.... one of my "favorite things"

A true jazz original who took "Giant Steps" forward.

Hmmmmmm....actually "Giant Steps" was the last album that featured Coltrane playing in a be-bop style (high level of course)....look to Miles Davis's "Kind of Blue" to Coltrane's transition to modal improvisation and the beginning of his Giant Steps...

DG

Hogan "looked" flatter because he had SUPER FLEXIBLE wrists that gave him a whole lot of wrist cock with very very little arm swing.

Also, i'd also recommend to learn how to trace a straight plane line on whatever plane you naturally swing on. If you are trying to change what plane angle you swing on just "cuz" you will ruin your swing long term.