Right forearm at address

golfer24
Do any pro's actually set the right forearm on plane with the clubshaft at address. I know this is a geometrically ideal position but why do none of the pro's i have in my V1 swing library set the forearm on this plane. These include Faldo, Donald, Baddeley, Riegger, Immelman, Els, Waite.............The list goes on.
12 piece bucket
Originally Posted by golfer24 Do any pro's actually set the right forearm on plane with the clubshaft at address. I know this is a geometrically ideal position but why do none of the pro's i have in my V1 swing library set the forearm on this plane. These include Faldo, Donald, Baddeley, Riegger, Immelman, Els, Waite.............The list goes on.

This looks like a job for a Fallen Angel from the Darkside . . . There is certainly an explanation . . . which could start a contentious debate . . . but there is an explanation.

Darkness!!!!!!!!


drewitgolf
Many tour players have been taught to grip the club in the fingers of the right hand rather than in the "cup"; hence no Right Forearm Flying Wedge at address, which may require a Plane Shift.

However, check out there Impact conditions from down the line view. You will probably see the Right Forearm on Plane, but with an Uncocked Right Wrist.
john riegger
well the v1 of myself is really old.there will be some new videos put up on here in the gallery coming soon.myself,brian watts,brian gay,kris cox craig barlow all setup with the right forearm on plane.didnt you know the tour players are the best in the world at throwaway.several of the aussies setup with it on plane also
drewitgolf
John,

Are you playing the Deutsche Bank Championship the first week in September?
Yoda
Originally Posted by golfer24
Do any pro's actually set the right forearm on plane with the clubshaft at address. I know this is a geometrically ideal position but why do none of the pro's i have in my V1 swing library set the forearm on this plane. These include Faldo, Donald, Baddeley, Riegger, Immelman, Els, Waite.............The list goes on.
It is true that most PGA TOUR players (past and present) do not set up with a perfectly On Plane Right Forearm. Most are close, but some are miles away.

I have written on this subject several times previously, especially the Address and Impact relationships of the Axis (Spine) Tilt (as effected by the Hip Turn), the Right Shoulder Location and the amount of Right Elbow Bend. These relationships determine the player's ability to position the Right Forearm On Plane. The wisdom to do so is something else again.

At bottom, it is very natural to stand to the Ball with both Shoulders at about the same level and both Arms reasonably straight and both Forearms pointing well inside the Plane Line. That "precision" is encouraged by the frequent instruction to "let the Arms hang freely" at Address. In other words, it is Position Golf -- not Alignment Golf -- in full flower. And even at the PGA TOUR level, it is, quoting Homer Kelley, "habit executing its ignorance."

Regarding John Riegger, I had the recent privilege of playing 18 holes with him at the TPC Summerlin in Las Vegas. I haven't seen the V1 sequence you reference, but I can tell you that on that particular day, John set up with his Right Forearm as On Plane as is humanly possible...

On every one of his 64 shots.

tongzilla
Your Right Forearm isn't going to be On Plane unless your Right Shoulder is at its Impact Fix Alignment, which requires the correct amount of Axis Tilt. So, for a Swinging procedure where you use the Classic Address, the Right Forearm will be almost On Plane, but not exactly since the Right Shoulder is too high.
Yoda
Originally Posted by tongzilla
Your Right Forearm isn't going to be On Plane unless your Right Shoulder is at its Impact Fix Alignment, which requires the correct amount of Axis Tilt. So, for a Swinging procedure where you use the Classic Address, the Right Forearm will be almost On Plane, but not exactly since the Right Shoulder is too high.
Assuming a Pivot Stroke and a Line Delivery Path, the Classic Adjusted Address position with its Between-the-Feet Pivot Center and equally-distributed Weight (Centered Hips) does not permit the Right Shoulder to be in its Impact Location. Hence, the Right Elbow Bend will be less at Address than at Impact. However, the On Plane Right Forearm at Address requires neither the Impact Fix degree of Right Elbow Bend nor the Down Plane Right Shoulder that creates it.

Remember, the purpose of the Pivot Stroke Delivery (6-K-0) is to bring the Assembled and Loaded Power Package (including the now fully-Bent Right Elbow) deep into the Release area before Triggering. At Address, the On Plane Right Forearm requires only that the Right Elbow be On Plane, not that it be fully-Bent and certainly not that it be in its Impact Location.

There is one other very important factor that affects both the degree of Right Elbow Bend and the alignment of the Right Forearm, and that is the Left Wrist Condition. At Address, the Wrist should be Level -- just as it is at Impact -- and not the slightest bit Cocked. This alignment slightly raises the Hands -- Level means Level, not Uncocked -- thereby permitting additional Right Elbow Bend. Simultaneously, it positions the Clubshaft more In-Line with the Left Forearm and, hence, also with the Right Forearm.
golfer24
Thank you Yoda,
Much clearer to me know. I have a slightly cocked left wrist at address which i am working on correcting to make it a level position. I am sure this will assist the right forearm address plane.

Can't wait to see the new video's of John considering he looked to be crunching the drives in the old clips i have of him, to see how good he will swing now will be cool. Sure the work with Rob Noel will be starting to pay dividends.
davel
Can you have the right forearm on plane at address and still grip the club in the fingers by adjusting elbow bend? The folding of the right elbow in the backswing and the left wrist cocking in a natural manner seem to favor a gtip in the fingers and not in the palm. Natural Golfers tend to use the palms and in mine and most peoples experience there is a dramatic loss in distance.

Dave


Originally Posted by Yoda It is true that most PGA TOUR players (past and present) do not set up with a perfectly On Plane Right Forearm. Most are close, but some are miles away.

I have written on this subject several times previously, especially the Address and Impact relationships of the Axis (Spine) Tilt (as effected by the Hip Turn), the Right Shoulder Location and the amount of Right Elbow Bend. These relationships determine the player's ability to position the Right Forearm On Plane. The wisdom to do so is something else again.

At bottom, it is very natural to stand to the Ball with both Shoulders at about the same level and both Arms reasonably straight and both Forearms pointing well inside the Plane Line. That "precision" is encouraged by the frequent instruction to "let the Arms hang freely" at Address. In other words, it is Position Golf -- not Alignment Golf -- in full flower. And even at the PGA TOUR level, it is, quoting Homer Kelley, "habit executing its ignorance."

Regarding John Riegger, I had the recent privilege of playing 18 holes with him at the TPC Summerlin in Las Vegas. I haven't seen the V1 sequence you reference, but I can tell you that on that particular day, John set up with his Right Forearm as On Plane as is humanly possible...

On every one of his 64 shots.