push and pull?

Is it possible to both pull and push the club through impact at the same time? I had someone ask me this the other day and could not come up a good answer, maybe you all could help me out.

Thanks,
Kevin

Originally Posted by kebeal Is it possible to both pull and push the club through impact at the same time? I had someone ask me this the other day and could not come up a good answer, maybe you all could help me out.

Thanks,
Kevin

IMHO-
Not really. Both qualities of the power source would be compromised and weaken. Some will say yes and argue the point til blue in the face. Pushing a pull is like a brake. Throwing out a push is off plane and reduces muscle power. Either one alone works great.

Another way to say it is.
all the left side is only being able to pull all the right side is only being able to pull.

I guess what I am trying to ask is this,

Imagine you and a buddy are discussing the golf stroke:

You Say: The golf club can be either pulled or pushed through impact

Your Buddy Says: why cant it be pulled and pushed through impact at the same time?

What would your response be?

Originally Posted by kebeal
What would your response be?

I would say "because pushing overrides centrifugal force" and if he wanted to know more, I would go a little deeper. But that is pretty good food for thought.

Originally Posted by kebeal Is it possible to both pull and push the club through impact at the same time? I had someone ask me this the other day and could not come up a good answer, maybe you all could help me out.

Thanks,
Kevin

1-F Only the Right Arm and Shoulder are in a position to “Push.” Everything else in the Stroke “Pulls.” Study Component 19.

If Homer’s statement above is correct then if, at the same time as you are using your Right Arm and Shoulder, you use anything else to assist in powering your stroke you must, by definition, be pushing and pulling at the same time. True or false?

It can't be done successfully or to any advantage.

Originally Posted by strav
If Homer’s statement above is correct then if, at the same time as you are using your Right Arm and Shoulder, you use anything else to assist in powering your stroke you must, by definition, be pushing and pulling at the same time. True or false?

For the most part, we are talking about the moment of truth...impact.

It can be argued that there several things that are pushed and pulled at the same time in the golf stroke. For instance, to pull from the ground up do you push the feet into the ground?

Back to impact...

6B nailed it above, but to add to his comments.
If you you are swinging and decide to override CF, then the stroke becomes a "hit" and if you haven't prepared your machine for hit characteristics such as angled hinging, clubface closing/layback and crossline delivery then you missed the shot.

If you are set up for hitting and decide during the stroke to pull with the pivot through impact your rhythm, clubface alignments and plane will also guarantee a weak/missed shot.

Study the Law of the Flail in 2-K for details.

I'm going to step out on a limb with more food for thought...

In a pure left arm swing, the (pushing) role of the right arm is to maintain or maximize extensor action without overriding centrifugal force. Some can say the the left arm is pulled straight by the right, others can say the right arm pushes the left arm straight. Still others will say, its neither because centrifugal force pulls both arms straight. Extensor action is what it is. It's the third side of the triangle attempting to fully straighten at all times. Homer called it Extensor Action because the use of it is active. Otherwise he would have called it Extensor Motion.

Adding structure with extensor action (an active right arm) will add distance to a swing by allowing resistance to hand deceleration as the accumulators are released to their inline condition. It also reduces clubhead deceleration during the impact collision. In this case, adding extensor action structure will feel like you are pushing through impact, but in reality you are resisting deceleration without overriding centrifugal force. You are maintaining a constant hand speed around the endless belt without disrupting centrifugal throw-out action.

This concept takes us into the "mysterious" realm of the 4-barrel swing. It takes you so close to throw-away that Homer only recommends it for the most skilled players. In other words there is a very fine line between a 4B swing and overriding CF, which turns the swing into a very bad hit.

Sustaaaaiiiinnnnn the laaaaggggggg....

6B - You answered my question very well, it just took some time for it to sink in. I appreciate yours and everyones resonse so far in this thread.

This place is great!

Originally Posted by drewitgolf It can't be done successfully or to any advantage.

The question was "Is it possible...?" not "Is it advisable...?"

Lee Trevino pulled with his last 3 fingers and nobody here will call him a swinger.

I would just go out on a limb here and say there are very few pure swingers on the PGA tour, but alot of horizontal hinge action.

Originally Posted by KnighT Lee Trevino pulled with his last 3 fingers and nobody here will call him a swinger.

I would just go out on a limb here and say there are very few pure swingers on the PGA tour, but alot of horizontal hinge action.

There is a pull at the start of the down swing for a Hitter to set up the radial pushing action. I think when folks speak of pulling and pushing at the SAME time - it is at release.

Originally Posted by strav The question was "Is it possible...?" not "Is it advisable...?"

Strav, when I wrote:

It can't be done successfully or to any advantage. I did not mean to imply it can't be done (impossible).