CF in hitting.

Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?

hb

Originally Posted by HungryBear Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?

hb

There is no cf in pure Hitting. The pivot accumulator, #4, is not used. 4-barrel Hitting uses a right shoulder drive before firing the right triceps, and it can go as deep as you can without uncocking the left wrist before firing the right triceps. If the LW starts unlocking from cf and you fire the right triceps then you will kill the club head lag created by cf. It's theoretically possible to recreate the lag with the right triceps, but not likely, and you will end up pushing a dead shaft through impact.

Originally Posted by HungryBear Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?

hb

The left arm is always swinging.

Bumpy

Originally Posted by Bumpy Forgot who I was responding to, this is a test isn't it?

Any mass, connected to and rotating around an axis will have a CF. The only way to zero CF is to move the axis parallel to the path the mass would travel if not connected. --OR-- (for the sake of brevity)

The left arm is always swinging.

Bumpy

Left arm is moving, but not from pivot power, only from the right triceps. Check out the yellow book - Hitting accumulators are 1,2,3. No #4.

Originally Posted by Bumpy Forgot who I was responding to, this is a test isn't it?

Any mass, connected to and rotating around an axis will have a CF. The only way to zero CF is to move the axis parallel to the path the mass would travel if not connected. --OR-- (for the sake of brevity)

The left arm is always swinging.

Bumpy

The "taking out of the slack" and shooting cross-line guarantees CF being present though for me at this point it is more an around CF and less of a down CF for swinging. The CF is present in the straight left arm having been stretched with Extensor Action.

http://youtu.be/c3C1__L5usM

http://youtu.be/1y2fH0ooCoQ


ICT

Originally Posted by innercityteacher The "taking out of the slack" and shooting cross-line guarantees CF being present though for me at this point it is more an around CF and less of a down CF for swinging. The CF is present in the straight left arm having been stretched with Extensor Action.

http://youtu.be/c3C1__L5usM

http://youtu.be/1y2fH0ooCoQ


ICT

Then please explain why 12-1-0, Component #4 is 1/2/3 and not 1/2/3/4. Do you think Homer made a mistake there or perhaps didn't understand?

Originally Posted by MizunoJoe Left arm is moving, but not from pivot power, only from the right triceps. Check out the yellow book - Hitting accumulators are 1,2,3. No #4.

Hitting or Swinging is irrelevant, the left arm swings.


Back to your regularly scheduled program:

Originally Posted by HungryBear Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?
hb

Originally Posted by Bumpy Hitting or Swinging is irrelevant, the left arm swings.


Back to your regularly scheduled program:

We have a piece of good ibformation. The left arm swings. with Zero #4 accumulator the arm swings- There is cf.

hb

Originally Posted by HungryBear We have a piece of good ibformation. The left arm swings. with Zero #4 accumulator the arm swings- There is cf.

hb

That's a piece of garbage, not good info. If the left arm swung in a pure Hiitting pattern, then Power Accumulator #4 would be included for a Hitting pattern, but it is not. The left arm is pushed out of the way by the right triceps, it doesn't swing.

Originally Posted by MizunoJoe That's a piece of garbage, not good info. If the left arm swung in a pure Hiitting pattern, then Power Accumulator #4 would be included for a Hitting pattern, but it is not. The left arm is pushed out of the way by the right triceps, it doesn't swing.

Swung is swung

Hb

MizunoJoe,

There is only one requirement for CF to be present in a golf stroke. And that requirement is strictly geometrical. Any time the club head has a somewhat curved path (which is basically all the time from top to finish) there will be CF present.

Hitting or swinging doesn't make a difference.

CF is nothing more (and nothing less) than club head inertia's response to an inward pulling effort (the other CF, Centripetal Force). The swinger manipulates these CF's to harness & control the throw-out and thereby the release. The hitter relies less on CF manipulation and more on muscle force to release the club and square up the club face, but both CF's are still present, has to be negotiated and is a key enabler to an efficient stroke with a chain reaction like release.

Originally Posted by HungryBear Swung is swung

Hb

Only by the spinning flywheel, which isn't present in a pure Hit because it's replaced by the extending right arm from the Top. It's only swung by being blasted off by the flywheel. In Hitting, it's a dead weight being pushed out of the way by the right triceps. Were it swung, 12-1-0, Component No 4 would be Four Barrel(1/2/3/4), instead of Triple Barrel(1/2/3) as listed on p 221.

Originally Posted by HungryBear Let's keep it simple;
1-L - 9. Regardless of how the Lever Assembly is driven, it moves in a circle.

HB

Originally Posted by HungryBear Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?

hb

If there is angular motion there is CF, but its effect on release are zeroed by the hitter. See: 6-F-0

Bumpy

Not zeroed, Bumpy.

It is getting "help" by the driveout. Or the driveout is getting help from CF. They help each other.

Originally Posted by BerntR Not zeroed, Bumpy.

It is getting "help" by the driveout. Or the driveout is getting help from CF. They help each other.

Driveout is providing the motion, which you claim is generating CF, which you then claim "helps" Driveout??? Sounds like the basis for a perpetual motion machine!

Throwout is preempted by Driveout. If CF were present in releasing #3, then the left arm would be the delivery mechanism, forcing #4 to be a PA in Hitting. But per 12-1-0, Hitting is Triple Barrel(1/2/3) not 4-barrel(1/2/3/4).

The oil companies wouldn't allow that mj that's why magnetic engines haven't caught on

Originally Posted by Bumpy If there is angular motion there is CF, but its effect on release are zeroed by the hitter. See: 6-F-0

Bumpy

Originally Posted by BerntR Not zeroed, Bumpy.

It is getting "help" by the driveout. Or the driveout is getting help from CF. They help each other.

OK, zeroed might be the wrong word, not sure help is correct either.


Per 6-F-0 ".....totally annuling and stifling any intrusion by CF".

If there is no intrusion, I'm going to regard its effect on the "overtaking rate" as PASSIVE.

If there was any "helping" going on I would be pulling and pushing at the same time.


Bumpy


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There AIN'T NO C.F. IN TRUE HITTING END OF STORY HOMER WROTE THE BOOK THE END GO SPEND Forty YEARS WORTH OF RESEARCH AND FELT BACK TO ME ALL YOU PIONEER'S IF GOLF THEOREM

Originally Posted by whip There AIN'T NO C.F. IN TRUE HITTING END OF STORY HOMER WROTE THE BOOK THE END GO SPEND Forty YEARS WORTH OF RESEARCH AND FELT BACK TO ME ALL YOU PIONEER'S IF GOLF THEOREM

Could U be a little more specific?

hb

Originally Posted by whip There AIN'T NO C.F. IN TRUE HITTING END OF STORY HOMER WROTE THE BOOK THE END GO SPEND Forty YEARS WORTH OF RESEARCH AND FELT BACK TO ME ALL YOU PIONEER'S IF GOLF THEOREM

Brilliant argument. Stating your perception then following that with Homer is right does not lend credibility by association. I think everybody agrees Homer is right. If your not capable of developing a valid argument you're just noise.

Bumpy

The problem here again is one of definition. Golfers talking to golfers with science degrees. Homers unique definition of the word mixed in.

I get the feeling no one is wrong above its just a matter of interpretation.

There's no cf (in the pivot power sense of the word ) for Drive Loading but there is cf present in the primary lever . Then there's Hitting with Pivot Power....

Originally Posted by whip There AIN'T NO C.F. IN TRUE HITTING END OF STORY HOMER WROTE THE BOOK THE END GO SPEND Forty YEARS WORTH OF RESEARCH AND FELT BACK TO ME ALL YOU PIONEER'S IF GOLF THEOREM

The earth isn't flat even though Homer Kelley omitted to clearly state that it is round. But you and MizunoJoe use flat-earth-arguments over and over, and attribute them to HK and TGM.

There are a lot of people in golf who understand enough physics to see that your "there ain't no CF in true hitting..." statement above is pure nonsense. Absurd claims such as these give TGM a bad reputation.

Back to the original question.

Originally Posted by HungryBear Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?

hb

A little anecdotal analysis;

I have seen data-can't locate it at the moment- that shows a golfer swinging with , left only, right only then both hands.

As I recall the results were approximately:
Left Only - 85 mph
Right only - 90 mph
Both (normal) - 105 mph

Conclusions;
Neither hand can produce the power both produces so swinging with either hand will be better if the other contributes.
The power is not a sum of the individual powers - if it was the result would be the (approx.) the square root of the sum of the squares of the p-ower from each hand.
[SqRoot of L squared + R squared] (would be about 124 mph in this example)

Even if there is only checkrein action by the left for hitting it is circular therefore cf exists.

It is very likely that either swinging-left hand or hitting/swinging Right hand , a substantial cf contribution is necessary.

Just me thinking.

HB